Poe2/Hondo Post Portland 1.0

• Wersje

First off, congrats on the great performance. I've been testing this pairing for my regional for about just under a month and am glad to see there is something here.

For the upcoming regional this weekend, I want to be mostly prepared for other special-based decks, and would rather not play Retreat. I like the card a lot in testing, but with how little long round decks there are I'd rather be prepared for the special meta. What would you put in that slot, assuming I just won't see those decks?

Also I have found that I like one Lone Operative over the second DL-44. Lone Operative has a special to chain into as well as having a decent die for the same cost, and although the DL can output more damage, the healing on the Operative has been great. Have you tried Lone Operative and what is your opinion on the card?

@snacksizebiscuit Adding Entangle or Mend over the Retreat would probably be a good call depending on meta. For this deck, since it definitely tries to take an aggressive stance, I'm not really a fan of Lone Operative. You have Second Chance, but you don't have the Caution or Force Illusion survivability tricks of the blue decks, so you really want stuff that just cranks damage. Plus DL-44s removal ability is fantastic to compliment the removal this deck runs.

Now that the Hondo-cat is out of the bag, could the Y-Wing be a way to keep a drain on resources and prevent your opponent from pooling resources? What about cards like Diversion? It just feels like Poe2/Hondo will need some evolution to stay competative.

@MrCarrier I don't think this deck will need much evolution to stay competitive. People get overly stuck on an opponent getting enough resources to neuter Hondo - which they will, particularly late game when resources are less valuable. But Hondo's strength is how he warps the early game, when people are trying to get set up and they don't have the resource generation. That's why Y-Wing doesn't really make sense, since it is so much slower and the goal isn't really to keep our opponent off resources ALL game. Poe2/Hondo comes out fast, stunts it's opponent's ability to get going, capitalizes with early aggression and the extra resources/damage, then hopefully already has an opposing character dead before it has to worry about Hondo's special being less effective.

I really don't think this deck is going anywhere

This thing just shreds! I have played something very similar but can't seem to find use for Fast Hands very often. How do you use it and do you find it useful? If I'm special chaining I don't really need it.

Fast Hands is killer. Get it on Hondo, roll him first and just start screwing with their resources immediately each round. First action taking their 2 resources is back breaking

Everyone is going to know how to play around Hondo. Hondo will not be relevant much longer. Even with fast hands he becomes stale at turn 3.

@MrCarrier I disagree, there is no "good" way to play around Hondo. His ability is always lose-lose. His ability to do damage might just be resources from round 3 on, but that's why this is an aggressive build to take advantage of how Hondo warps the first couple rounds of the game . And resources later can be turned into stronger removal and things like Planetary Uprising.

@thegandorkok then. I understand you’re tied to this deck and I appreciate the feedback. So how do you play around the Impulsive into All In combo? Seems Yoda/Zeb just wrecks with this combo.

@MrCarrier Yoda/Zeb is relying on Zeb for damage in the early rounds, so focusing removal towards getting a zeb dice off the board each round goes a long way. Even if they want to Impulsive/All In combo, being down a die on Zeb hampers their overall damage output. Remove a Zeb die even if it isn't showing a good side at the moment. Yoda can make money, but generally they have to choose money or shields if they're special chaining - so if they have money they're less tanky, plus they've probably still planning on paying off Hondo, which will hinder them on their own upgrades or Zeb's pay side. Target Zeb first, Yoda will be a pushover once he's off the table. Vandalize for Force Speed most likely, not sure of the list. Roll fire

@thegandorkThanks for the advice. What about the Heroes Vehicle deck (Hyperloops posted one). It's oppressive and floods the board with dice. Especially if they get a Rally Aid in their opening hand. They can make tons of money to fuel their supports. I can't figure out how to beat it...

@MrCarrier cards like Retreat or Hyperspace Jump can totally ruin a hero vehicles game practically buying free turns against them. So if I was expecting hero vehicles, pack a couple of those

@thegandorkI think having x2 Retreat is almost a must for those slower decks with more dice. But what do you take out? And how do you deal with Poe's squishiness? Other than Field Medic there is not much you an do to keep him in the fight past round 2-3.

@thegandork I really do appreciate the advice. But you're explanations are overly simplified and assume perfect draws and your opponent does nothing. People know how to play around Hondo. And once Poe is dead, which happens very easily since there are minimal tools to keep him alive, the game is over. You opponent is going to mitigate your dice. They are going to take resources. They are going to aggressively re-roll into damage. And since there is no Sound The Alarm or free mitigation this deck fails to straight up sticks and guns. We will see how things go this next weekend with the next round of regionals....

@MrCarrier Uhh isn't that just overly simplified explanations just like you accused me of giving? But you're right, we will see

@thegandork I'll chalk it up to my lack of skill with this game. In the games I've played with this deck, I don't understand how it's expected to win versus anyone who knows exactly how to play around Hondo.

@MrCarrier I'll bite, give me some insight into how you play around Hondo

I've made a couple small tweeks to this deck and Poe last long enough to do some serious work. After that the weapons (I added some redeploy) move to Hando, add that to the possible three specials for Hondo (with cunning) and things go poorly for your opponent. It is still a dice game, so cards/dice need to show up when you need them, but the same is true for your opponent.

@MrCarrierI'm new to the Pondo deck, can you tell me how to play around Hondo?

@MrCarrier Hondo is a card much like Unkar in his ability to manipulate the game state and your opponent's choices. Are there ways to play around that type of card? Obviously there are, but that doesn't make it easy/economical for most decks. Saying that he's easy to play around now that you know he's in the meta is a little short-sighted. I think this decklist will continue to evolve, using Hondo's abilities and special chaining to tilt the game. If nothing else, you have to admit that his abilities change the way you look at your board and your hand when you play against him, and his special absolutely effects how you play your turn. Coupled with Poe's special and the amount of refocus sides this deck carries, you're forced to play around Hondo. Even if that's 'easy', which I don't agree with, he's still a strong character.
Personally I am interested to know what easy ways you've found to play around him in the current build. As someone who's building the deck and likely to play against it too, I'd love for you to share you tech.

@thegandorkWhat are your thoughts about using the Camouflaged Rifle instead of the Canto Bight Pistol? I know you're claiming faster than most decks, and it would work good against hero/villain decks because you most likely will have the battlefield. Is it because of the redeploy on the pistol?

@thegandork Did you ever test Double-Dealing in this deck? It seems a good fit for resources to pay for the weapons and doesn't slow you down too much.

@Will.I.Am Camouflaged Rifle was definitely considered, but it was both the all base sides and redeploy that made us side with Canto Bight Pistol. Figuring if Hondo gets stuck at the end with one, Canto is probably a little more useful.

`@Lloydie With the Hondo money stealing, we generally felt pretty good on money most of the time with the concession for the 2 x Well Connected to help us get going a little bit if needed. Double-Dealing is actually quite a bit slow for a deck like this since it takes you 2 rounds before you actually profit off of it - so if you play it round 1 it only pays for itself, then round 2 you're finally making a profit. Heading into round 3 or 4 we either have the game mostly under control and/or money is just not that valuable from that point.

Would'nt Hyperspace Jump be better than Retreat even if it cost 1 more since you might not get your battlefield in play in many games? (maybe you prefer getting the shields and that's why you play this battlefield). How do you distribute the shields if you don't start with your battlefield? I would put 1 on each character or 2 on Hondo Ohnaka - Respected Businessman but I'm curious about how you place them.

@maximus Yeah, you could definitely make a case for Hyperspace Jump or Retreat, but there is definitely a huge upside to having a card that costs 2 resources, which is what you get every upkeep, vs 3 resources that you'd have to make money or have carryover for.

I never take shields given the choice though - Hondo wants to go first since his ability is so strong when you have tempo. This deck's average starting roll is pretty bad though so you don't get the choice often.

For shields, if you know your opponent's aren't familiar with the deck, 1 on each character is good. If your opponent's are familiar with the deck, they should be trying to kill Poe first, so I put both shields on him. I think an opponent going after Hondo first is a mistake - Hondo is a lot worse in the late game than Poe is AND Hondo gets Second Chance to back him up which might severely punish you for trying to get him down.

Was Maz's Vault considered over Well-Connected? If Hondo Ohnaka - Respected Businessman goes down, that's a dead card. I see the danger in giving your opponent an extra resource; just curious.